TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby jumarcil » Wed Nov 16, 2011 1:43 pm

sq225917 wrote:The TS is a way better jumper than last year, more low end, a touch more bar pressure and a little less up top but the feel unhooked is simply out there, anything under a 10m rocks it unhooked on the waves.

I had the chance to test the 10m TS in some decent conditions monday and wow that kite can pull some massive big jumps. I was really surprise at how much more lift it has as compared to last year taboo.

It really is a better freeride kite, really good low-end; still plenty fast for me and the jumps; :twisted: WOW !!!

PS: I'm keeping my 8m taboo for High wind sessions though.


I just love it :-) :supz: :supz: :supz:
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby pbisland » Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:13 am

Hey NAG i think you used to fly 08 HP's? Killed my 7M 08 HP today and need to replace it....7 or 8M TS? I flew a 8Taboo a few times last year, nice kite but needed a bunch of wind, and have a 10M Taboo to compliment my 10M 08 HP.

Simon.....7 or 8M?
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby NAG » Mon Nov 21, 2011 6:19 am

Hi PB - Yes, 08 HPs were my favorite kites. The Taboo & TS are quite different timing and feel wise compared to the HP.

The new TS jumps well, much better then the Taboo. It's not a 08 HP, but it's pretty nice. It turns very well too - much better then the 08 HP, it's a much nicer wave kite then the HP. The TS is a lower aspect kite then the HP. It has much 'smoother' power delievery - you will know that from the 10 Taboo - the 8TS is like a faster turning 10 taboo, and it now has decent low end.

I don't think the 8m TS has the top end that the 08 7HP had. That was awesome.

Incidentally, I am really liking the 8m Taboo (not TS) in higher wind at the moment. It doesn't jump very well, but the top end is extraordinary for an 8 and it is a very, very well behaved kite for waves. Much better then the HP - it doesn't have any power spikes and its pull is quite 'gentle' - so as long as you have enough wind to generate power by flying it around (let's say 20kts to be honest), it's great as it doesn't pull you off when you whack it around. And it turns sooo nicely, and the top end just goes and goes - maybe better then the 7HP (that used to really pull when the wind was high I remember). I nearly sold this kite, but held back after a killer session on my son's 5.5 Taboo which reminded me of it's qualities and now I'm glad I kept it.

The TS has more low end, is a (much) better jumper then the Taboo, but it does pull you round more (read 'drag' you more) when you whack it around powered on a wave. I'm loving more wave powered surfboard turning rather then kite powered turns on waves at the moment and the Taboo is better for this. Once you have enough wind (the big Taboo caveat) it's hard to beat for a purer surf experience. Also the Taboo is lighter on the bar, but still has nice direct feel.

The 8 Taboo is fine at 35kts, the 8TS is really powered up in this wind.

the 5.5 Taboo is a high wind kite only for an adult. 27kts-> +++++ I have had it gusting to 50kts and it still handles OK. Never tried the TS in this size so can't compare.

BTW - I sold my 10 Taboo as I found I preferred the 9.5 Kahoona and hardly ever used it after the 'new gear' novelty factor wore off. Not intending to replace it. Hope this helps.
-Niko
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby pumpnjump » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:02 am

Hi Nag, get yourself a go on the 7m TS, its the new 8 Taboo, am I smiling or what!!! this thing turns on a dime, never flown a kite so comfortable unhooked, jumps like mad and turns so fast did I say that already :-)
I believe it has pretty much the same wind range as the 8 Taboo but in waves its better, jumping its better, unhooked its better and thats saying a lot as I love the 8 Taboo.
For those considering the TS you will need to give it a few goes, I was a little unsure on my first ride of the 8TS,
by my forth session I absolutely loved it, you are then dialed into the kite, so getting on the 7 TS I felt instantly at home. Now all we need is some real wind to get on the 5.5.
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby pbisland » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:29 pm

Hey Nico, thanks for the thoughtful response. I agree with most of what you say.

My reality is different then yours regards real wind. We seldom get 35knots and if/when we do it is usually out of control gusty. So, i am looking to replace my 7M, which is my high wind kite. I bought the 8 Taboo when Best was clearing their warehouse for their big move. After 2 times on the kite it was obvious it needs a bunch of wind, so i got the 10 Taboo.

We have actually been getting decent / good waves with wind lately. I am on a tt in waves but still have fun and go fast. My concern is bottom end to match my 7 HP. I don't think the 8 Taboo had the same bottom, so i am hesitant to go 7 TS, but don't want to get blown out of the water on a 8. What is a comparable Kahoona? I had a 9.5 V1 Kahoona but did not enjoy the characteristics of that kite. What is a comparable Kahoona to the 7M HP? It appears the V1 is substantially different that V3 / V4 and that the smaller sizes are different animals then the 9.5 i had.

Thanks....
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby sq225917 » Thu Nov 24, 2011 6:30 am

7m HP replacement.

5.5Kahoona, it'll drop you faster and won't quite match the low end, but it's awesome in the waves.
7m TS, not the same solid low end, but more workable, broadly similar lift when massively overpowered but not the same hangtime. Lighter and faster on the bar though,

8M TS, same low end, not the same top end though, similar turning speed but not as fast across the window. If I didn't mind losing the top end, I'd go for this.

8m HP v3, What's not to like. We are now working with new potential vendors for a replacement for Cuben fiber. We have enough Cuben in stock for one more season but we are unlikely to revisit the HP design once more. If you love em, stock up on them.
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby NAG » Wed Dec 07, 2011 6:51 am

Hi PB - Just moved house so a lot of things going on.

The 7HP had great bottom end, and I'd agree the 8 Taboo isn't as good. The 5.5 Kahoona has amazing bottom end for its size, you can get going from 20 knots if you work the kite, maybe even a tiny bit less. I'd say the new 8TS that I flew has similar or maybe a tiny bit more bottom then the 7HP, it's got more then the 8 Taboo for sure, but it's some time since I used the 7. The 7.5 K has a lot more bottom then the 7HP, it's more like the 9HP bottom end (seriously).

I too did not like the v1 Kahoona 9.5. The 7.5 in that size was one of my favorite all time kites, the v2 wasn't as good IMO. The v2 9.5 is ok, the v3 in all sizes (5.5->11.5) is super nice, haven't tried the v4 but I can't see how it can be much better then the v3 (except perhaps improving turn speed in larger sizes). My v3s are keepers.

Pump, I'm taking your advice and have ordered a 7 and 9 TS to replace my sold 10 and 8 Taboos. That golden ticket promotion made it possible - a welcome nice surprise to see that coming back this year, especially as cash is tight right now. Good job, SQ. Bummed I missed out on silver tickets though - could have used a couple of new bars. My trusty '07s are just going to have to last another year.

looking forward to it and hoping that 9TS is fast turning... feedback once I've had them for a bit.
-Niko
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby NAG » Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:15 am

Just got the 9 & 7TS, together with a little wind the last couple of days - 13- 14kts on Friday and a gusty 12-16kts yesterday with a choppy, messy 1.25m beach break.

Bar 50cm, 22m lines, 5' 6" airush choptop - which is my preferred higher volume strapless board, great for lighter winds.

Got to say it's great to get back onto this kite having been mainly on Kahoonas for a few months. The TS is much more alive then the Kahoona, a more direct and engaging kiting experience. As with the Taboo, this is a flyer's kite - it rewards when you flick it around, responding immediately to turning input by pivoting around the wingtip with super smooth power.

I'm glad to say the 9TS is a lot more like the 8TS then then 10TS, which I found a fair amount slower then the 10 Taboo - a bit too slow for me. Hard to be objective as it wasn't a back to back, but I'd say the 9TS on 50 bar turns similarly to the 10 Taboo on a 55. Feel is very similar, but the big improvement is low end. The 10 Taboo would have be struggling on Friday, I would have taken a 11.5 Kahoona normally in those conditions. But unlike the Taboo, the 9TS generates good power when you move it around under powered, and responded with enough juice to keep me upwind.

Yesterday, with a bit more wind, people were out in force. One guy on a 9 taboo could not hold ground in the beach break; there were a couple of others on 12 Taboos and they were doing OK. Other riders on 9.5 Kahoonas were doing fine, so this was a great comparison. The 9TS was perfect - in fact I found myself able to reach further up wind then the 12m Taboo riders with no problems. And when a lull came, I was still able to generate enough power to keep going, something missing in the Taboos.

The best bit was when a remotely reasonable wave came along, as the TS handles very similarly to the Taboo. Depowering, it's all about using the wave, then pulling the bar in, the kite responds by quickly coming round without yanking you of the wave. Single handed steering is no problem, and the bar has a great alive feel, a little lighter then the v3 9.5 K.

This was more of a low end test, I was on a strapless board so no jumping today, no unhooking due to chop, and definitely nowhere near the top end!

Performance was good with a 50 cm bar, I will try with a 55 next time - it feels like the 9TS can handle even more turn bar input to bring it around even quicker and still be buttery smooth in lighter winds.

I am happy - the 9TS significantly improves on the weak areas of the Taboo, whilst retaining it lovely flying characteristics. Can't wait to try it out in more wind and also crack out the 7.

Well done, guys.
-Niko
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby reverse777 » Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:03 am

Finally have our usual wind back so was able to get out there and test my new 7mt TS.

Straight out of the bag , set up on the low wind setting 20mt lines, I weigh 71kgs.
Wind was around 21 - 25knots with a 57cm RP Bar , small waves on a 5'11" custom surfboard and I like to fly my kites with power and aggression and a lot just using 1 hand.

First Impression was WOW!! I really like this. Turning was so responsive , direct . I now understand why PUMPNJUMP was raving. Bar pressure way less than the Kahoona V3 9.5mt or 7.5mt V2.

On waves whether you were on your back or forward hand you had the ability to work it , do a few reos with carving top turns with small air and ability to position kite to drift when using the power of the wave.

Upwind ability was excellent, I was expecting to have to work the kite a lot like the 8mt taboo but not all , if you had too it was responsive and was way easy. Unhooking I am not at that stage so can not comment as yet.

A few weeks ago I had the chance to demo the TS 5,5mt in 25 - 30knots + winds and I was equally impressed.

Like BEST say Intermediate to Advanced for the TS range especially the smaller kites , they fly across the window super fast with power, so if you don't know what you are doing it will punish you.

I now want the same quiver as NAG n PUMPNJUMP 5,5 , 7 , 9 TS and 11.5 V4 Kahoona. ( European crisis outcome pending )

Also the new 2012 RP Bar is a great improvement over the 2011 version and looks the goods. No sudden self releasing by touching the emergency cuff . Only need to look at the power- depower tab so that you don't have to stretch so far to get a hold of it for us shorter people.

Good on you Best you have excelled this year , keep it up.
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby NAG » Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:58 pm

Just came back from another test session with the TSs, was mucking about with a kitecam mounted waterproof camera strapped to the middle strut getting ready for a megga session tomorrow (levante starts coming in :wink: ). Man the settings for these camera mounting things is fiddly.

First time on the 7TS. WOW. Pump, you are spot on with your comments. That 7TS is fast - fastest setting on a 50cm bar. Super nice flying characteristics, and very, very nice unhooked. Light on the bar but still with good kite feedback. This thing pivots very nicely on a wingtip, keeping power generation, it's easy to loop it 720, even 1080. I am going to love this thing on waves. Wind too light to really comment more then this though.

9TS on a 55cm bar. I prefer this size, a bit quicker in the turn compared to the 50cm I used earlier in the week, still fast enough for aggressive wave riding. Coming from the 7TS, a fair amount slower turning, but still nice and responsive, much more so then the 9.5 K. 720s are doable on the turn, it pivots nicely like the 7, but you need a fair amount more sky (succeeded in crashing it once, just couldn't bring it round fast enough as my 07 bar center jammed on worn depower lines. Time to get a new big bar as soon as I can afford it - those center low friction inserts are nice). I continue to be impressed by the bottom end improvements compared to the Taboo.

Cannot wait to try the 7TS in earnest with good wind this weekend!
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby NAG » Tue Dec 27, 2011 7:11 am

Ok, now got a bit more time on these two kites.

Pump, you are spot on about the 7TS. It's the new and improved 8 Taboo, better in every aspect. I've been using it on 50cm bar on the fast setting - good for me in waves, but too fast for freestyle (according to my son). This is a dynamite wave kite which now has a some low end too. Was out in horribly gusty 24 to 35+ kts, blown out wind swell on a short 5'4" and didn't feel overpowered. It does turn and move fast so it takes a little getting used to, and generates a fair amount of power when you flick it - but still nicely smooth.

Then an epic 9TS wave session yesterday in Soto - heavy, fast and a bit messy head to 1.5 overhead, the occasional double overhead monster. Wind 17-24 at the beach, on a 6' Airush Converse, 55cm bar. I do like this kite but I can feel it's been tweaked for freestyle stability over turn. Not as much as the 10 TS, but even with a 55cm bar I was finding it just a little slower to come around then I would have liked - would have been nice if the 10TS was as it is for the freestyle guys but optimize the 9TS more for us wave merchants. Maybe Leave the center of the canopy as is to keep the low end and nice jumping, but tweak the shape slightly around the next struts to get a little more turn responsiveness? I'm no kite designer, but maybe something for next year?

Not a massive thing, and otherwise a super kite which now generates nice power in the low end when worked and the drift is simply awesome. The bar feels pretty light, easy 1 handed control, but by the end of the session I felt that I had had a workout in my shoulders, completely different feeling to the Kahoonas. Nice, I really like it!

The 7 - 9 combo is a good quiver range wise. The 9 isn't a low wind kite but now has good low end for its size.
-Niko
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby jumarcil » Thu Jan 05, 2012 8:33 am

sq225917 wrote:7m HP replacement.

5.5Kahoona, it'll drop you faster and won't quite match the low end, but it's awesome in the waves.
7m TS, not the same solid low end, but more workable, broadly similar lift when massively overpowered but not the same hangtime. Lighter and faster on the bar though,

8M TS, same low end, not the same top end though, similar turning speed but not as fast across the window. If I didn't mind losing the top end, I'd go for this.

8m HP v3, What's not to like. We are now working with new potential vendors for a replacement for Cuben fiber. We have enough Cuben in stock for one more season but we are unlikely to revisit the HP design once more. If you love em, stock up on them.

I am selling my 8m taboo and I am hesitating between the 7m and the 8m TS. I have the 10m TS already. I want a kite that I can hold up to 35 knots. I also want a kite that has more lift than the 8m taboo (not very good for jump) but I still want a kite that can fly great in high and gusty wind.

so 7m or 8m ?
thanks
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Re: TS vs Taboo - 10m & 8m

Postby NAG » Fri Jan 06, 2012 11:36 am

Get the 7TS, especially if you have the 10. No question. The 8TS is too close. The 7TS is like the 8Taboo but better in every way. Jumps much better, top end at least equal, more low end power, etc. Read Pump's post above. What he says is spot on.

Just came back from another session on the 9TS, light 16kts wind. I am liking the feel of this kite a lot. It generally feels quite like the 10 Taboo, but flies a bit faster. The bar feedback is just perfect for me, and the weight is not heavy. The weight feel is different from the Kahoona, and I find I am using different arm muscles to the Kahoona, which could be a good thing for tendinitis sufferers. This is because I'm flying the kite around more to generate power rather then mainly sheeting in and out as with the Kahoona. It's a much more involving kiting experience which keeps it interesting. I find I'm mainly flying it around when cruising to keep momentum (remember, it was only 16kts), but there's no need to do that when hitting the waves - just let the bar out and surf, pull in to juice up or whack it around on a turn.

It moves fast through the air and it likes board speed.

I'm using a 55cm bar, 22m lines. I'm used to the turning speed now, it does feel quite balanced with the kite's speed. Having said that I still feel a bit robbed in waves where a quicker turn would be awesome. The 10TS is just too slow to come around for me, even with full bar 55cm input. The 9TS could be so much better, but I'd only rate it as passable - only a bit better. It would be awesome if the FAST turn settings really were fast with a big bar (for wave riding), leaving the SLOW perfect for freestyle (perhaps with a short bar). Put it this way, I'd use a 60cm bar with this kite if I had one.

Otherwise this kite continues to impress in every area. The 7 / 9 TS combo is awesome. If it wasn't slow turning I'd be tempted to get a 14 TS to round out the low wind quiver but for now I'm sticking with my 11 Kahoona (not the fastest turning kite either).
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